Author Topic: Rant  (Read 1620 times)

Offline Chaos

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Rant
« on: June 13, 2017, 01:00:27 PM »
Watching local news, 3 motorcycle fatalities yesterday.  One at 2 am, failed to negotiate a turn.  One 16 year old on a dirt bike on private property.  One car turned left, did not see bike. None of them with helmets.  Local station interviewed a vtwin focused speed shop owner who immediately stated  "if you don't have loud pipes that's what happens, if they can't hear you they can't see you".  I almost threw my shoe at the TV.  Not particularly ATGATT myself, especially in hot weather, but have never assumed someone with AC, cellphone, Itunes and screaming kids is going to pay attention to anything outside their box.   Anyway, be careful out there, kidney season is in full swing.
1987 K75S    VIN 0231
Original litter & owner
185,000 miles and 5 paint jobs
2012 Ural Gear-Up
(BMW's bastard step child)

Offline BrickMW

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Re: Rant
« Reply #1 on: June 13, 2017, 02:38:24 PM »
Any time I hear the "hear you / see you" or "loud pipes save lives" excuses for being obnoxious self made spectacles, I ask, then why not put a crazy straw loop-d-loop in them and a nice bugle tip and point them out the front? Or maybe ambulances and firetrucks should all have their sirens pointing out the back from under the rear bumpers...
  • Huntsville, AL
  • 1986 K75c
Luft & Jager... My two favorite Meister's :bmwsmile

Offline Christopherguzzi

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Re: Rant
« Reply #2 on: September 28, 2017, 01:23:27 AM »
While accidents can happen to anyone at any time, most crashes are single vehicle accidents caused by the riders inability to sucessfully negotiate a turn.  More often than not by an inexperienced rider who doesn't have a valid motorcycle endorsement.  Simply put, these are things that a muffler or lack thereof cannnot fix.  My advice is to take an experienced rider course every few years if one is available in your area.  They are a lot of fun and will definitely sharpen your skills.
  • Little Canada, Minnesota
  • 1986 K75C
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Offline Scott_

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Re: Rant
« Reply #3 on: September 28, 2017, 07:00:14 AM »
If that "loud" crap was actually true and proved with irrefutable facts, not a single bike would be made with a muffler.
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Offline Chaos

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Re: Rant
« Reply #4 on: September 28, 2017, 10:09:31 AM »
A harley rider saw this on my Ural and did not understand the sarcasm
1987 K75S    VIN 0231
Original litter & owner
185,000 miles and 5 paint jobs
2012 Ural Gear-Up
(BMW's bastard step child)

Offline JPaganel

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Re: Rant
« Reply #5 on: September 28, 2017, 11:56:47 AM »
While accidents can happen to anyone at any time, most crashes are single vehicle accidents caused by the riders inability to sucessfully negotiate a turn. 

Nope.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_findings_in_the_Hurt_Report

"Approximately three-fourths of these motorcycle accidents involved collision with another vehicle, which was most usually a passenger automobile."

More often than not by an inexperienced rider who doesn't have a valid motorcycle endorsement. 

That would be more correct.

"In the single vehicle accidents, motorcycle rider error was present as the accident precipitating factor in about two-thirds of the cases, with the typical error being a slide-out and fall due to overbraking or running wide on a curve due to excess speed or under-cornering.

Motorcycle riders with previous recent traffic citations and accidents are overrepresented in the accident data.

The motorcycle riders involved in accidents are essentially without training; 92% were self-taught or learned from family or friends. Motorcycle rider training experience reduces accident involvement and is related to reduced injuries in the event of accidents.More than half of the accident-involved motorcycle riders had less than 5 months experience"
  • Minnesnowta
  • 1986 K100RT, 1996 R1100RS

Offline Chaos

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Re: Rant
« Reply #6 on: September 28, 2017, 01:20:13 PM »
I forget the figures, but I was amazed at the huge percentage of MC fatalities here in Ohio that had neither a MC endorsement nor a helmet. 
1987 K75S    VIN 0231
Original litter & owner
185,000 miles and 5 paint jobs
2012 Ural Gear-Up
(BMW's bastard step child)

Offline BrickMW

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Re: Rant
« Reply #7 on: September 28, 2017, 01:27:06 PM »
Here are some actual statistics and sobering numbers.. The motorcycle landscape has changed greatly over the last 50 years, the myths and urban legends have not.


1 in 4 fatal motorcycle crashes involve an unlicensed or non-endorsed operator.
2 in 5 single vehicle, fatal motorcycle crashes were alcohol-impared
26 to 1 - motorcyclist fatalities vs. passenger vehicle occupant fatalities (per miles traveled)


Motorcycle accidents and fatalities are becoming less frequent by percentage of the growing number of motorcycles. The data proves that a properly licenced / endorsed, sober, motorcyclist, wearing a helmet, and obeying the speed limit, traffic laws and controls has the lowest percentage of both injuries and fatalities.


It is a great read and I encourage giving it a glance.


https://crashstats.nhtsa.dot.gov/Api/Public/ViewPublication/812148


  • Huntsville, AL
  • 1986 K75c
Luft & Jager... My two favorite Meister's :bmwsmile

Offline Blue

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Re: Rant
« Reply #8 on: September 28, 2017, 02:12:34 PM »
The Hurt Report is 41 years old.  As BrickMW says, "changed greatly".

Just last week I had to go to the fog line as a herd of pirates turned in too early and crossed the centerline at apex.  This was a simple mid-speed curve with open sightlines.  Happens daily.

All riders need to know David L. Hough's body of work.
  • Stovepipe Wells CA
  • 1995 K1100RS

Offline Christopherguzzi

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Re: Rant
« Reply #9 on: September 28, 2017, 02:28:59 PM »
Nope.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_findings_in_the_Hurt_Report

"Approximately three-fourths of these motorcycle accidents involved collision with another vehicle, which was most usually a passenger automobile."

That would be more correct.

"In the single vehicle accidents, motorcycle rider error was present as the accident precipitating factor in about two-thirds of the cases, with the typical error being a slide-out and fall due to overbraking or running wide on a curve due to excess speed or under-cornering.

Motorcycle riders with previous recent traffic citations and accidents are overrepresented in the accident data.

The motorcycle riders involved in accidents are essentially without training; 92% were self-taught or learned from family or friends. Motorcycle rider training experience reduces accident involvement and is related to reduced injuries in the event of accidents.More than half of the accident-involved motorcycle riders had less than 5 months experience"


Thanks JPaganel, I stand corrected and do not wish to spread misinformation regarding such a complicated and important topic to us riders.  While more up to date research would be greatly welcomed, the Hurt Report you reference which studied motorcycle accidents and related data taking place in the city of Los Angeles, CA from 1976-77 is still surprisingly among the best we have to look to on this subject. 

  • Little Canada, Minnesota
  • 1986 K75C
Christopherguzzi

Offline boostd4

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Re: Rant
« Reply #10 on: September 28, 2017, 02:46:33 PM »
Lol.  I see what you did there.
  • Chicago, IL
  • 85 K100RS Cafe/Streetfighter project

Offline Scott_

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Re: Rant
« Reply #11 on: September 28, 2017, 06:04:55 PM »
Dave Hough spoke at our Iowa riders safety forum this spring and the topic was discussed of re-evaluating the Hurt report. Smaller spot surveys over the years have not shown enough difference in results to justify a complete full blown repeat of the Hurt study. So it still stands.
  • My Garage
Ride safe.


1997 K1100LT 0302488
1995 K1100LT 0302044
Garmin StreetPilot 2820
Garmin Zumo 550
"One who does not ask questions is ashamed to learn" Danish proverb

Offline jaxon

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Re: Rant
« Reply #12 on: September 28, 2017, 07:30:54 PM »
  "if you don't have loud pipes that's what happens, if they can't hear you they can't see you".


I'm willing to bet not one accident report in this entire country has this on it:


"Cause of accident: Exhaust pipes not loud enough."



  • Indiana
  • '92 K75S, '17 R1200GS LC
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Offline Laitch

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Re: Rant
« Reply #13 on: September 28, 2017, 09:07:28 PM »
 :clap:
  • Along the Ridley in Vermont.
  • 1995 K75T 60,000 miles
I wept because I had no radials until I met a man who had no splines.

Offline Christopherguzzi

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Re: Rant
« Reply #14 on: September 28, 2017, 10:42:35 PM »
It takes a lot of hard work, dedication, and intellect to go into the medical profession, but it's so much easier to simply remove the mufflers and catalytic converter from your motorcycle and drive around annoying the hell out of people in order to save lives.


If only life were that simple.

 
 :dunno2: :neener: :hehehe
  • Little Canada, Minnesota
  • 1986 K75C
Christopherguzzi

Offline Motorhobo

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Re: Rant
« Reply #15 on: October 02, 2017, 11:48:22 AM »
All of the people I know with loud pipes who have reversed the output angle of the exhaust so that the volume points forward such that oncoming traffic can hear it have reported that their pipes have definitely saved their lives on at least one occasion.



Current:
1995 K75 ABS since 2000, 107k mi (101k mine)
1994 K75 ABS since 2015, 175k mi (none mine, waiting to be rejuvenated)

Dog Sidecar:
1994 K75 since 2013, 76,000 mi (11k mine) w/
California Sidecar Friendship II & Black Lab 'Miss B'

Past:
1974 Honda 550/4 (first bike)
1994 K75 (sold)
Sidecar Dog & Best Bud 'Bo' - RIP

Offline JPaganel

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Re: Rant
« Reply #16 on: October 02, 2017, 01:09:09 PM »
Them Harley guys are kinda fragile.

Last week I got a literal death threat from this Internet tough guy because I said that a. loud bikes are loud because people make them that way on purpose and b. "loud pipes save lives" is bunk.

He called me a snob, an a-hole that ruins it for everybody, a c-sucker, and then said he'd like to teach me a lesson with his AR-15.

All over some fart noises he likes to make...
  • Minnesnowta
  • 1986 K100RT, 1996 R1100RS

Offline Motorhobo

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Re: Rant
« Reply #17 on: October 02, 2017, 01:50:58 PM »
Dude -- I'd call the FBI. Free speech is one thing but this is the post-Vegas world we live in now.
Current:
1995 K75 ABS since 2000, 107k mi (101k mine)
1994 K75 ABS since 2015, 175k mi (none mine, waiting to be rejuvenated)

Dog Sidecar:
1994 K75 since 2013, 76,000 mi (11k mine) w/
California Sidecar Friendship II & Black Lab 'Miss B'

Past:
1974 Honda 550/4 (first bike)
1994 K75 (sold)
Sidecar Dog & Best Bud 'Bo' - RIP

Offline jaxon

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Re: Rant
« Reply #18 on: October 02, 2017, 01:52:27 PM »
Them Harley guys are kinda fragile.

Last week I got a literal death threat from this Internet tough guy because I said that a. loud bikes are loud because people make them that way on purpose and b. "loud pipes save lives" is bunk.

He called me a snob, an a-hole that ruins it for everybody, a c-sucker, and then said he'd like to teach me a lesson with his AR-15.

All over some fart noises he likes to make...


Does he ride a Sportster? I mean that's a girls bike.
  • Indiana
  • '92 K75S, '17 R1200GS LC
--
This space for rent

Offline Chaos

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Re: Rant
« Reply #19 on: October 02, 2017, 02:01:45 PM »

Does he ride a Sportster? I mean that's a girls bike.

Heard the same said about my K75 from my K100-1100 friends.  But I know some big dudes who ride scooters.  And I agree the pirate crowd is sensitive, comes from having to trailer their bike everywhere.
 
1987 K75S    VIN 0231
Original litter & owner
185,000 miles and 5 paint jobs
2012 Ural Gear-Up
(BMW's bastard step child)

Offline jaxon

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Re: Rant
« Reply #20 on: October 02, 2017, 02:21:01 PM »
Heard the same said about my K75 from my K100-1100 friends.  But I know some big dudes who ride scooters.  And I agree the pirate crowd is sensitive, comes from having to trailer their bike everywhere.


The "Girl's Bike" phrase really upsets some Harley riders. I think a really emotionally fragile people get offended. Ride what you like or what your budget allows.


I've never heard my K75S is a "girl's bike." I wish someone would say that around my wife, maybe she'd try to ride it. :bmwsmile


It's a little heavier for her but I remind her it weighed about a hundred pounds less than the Sportster she owned and rode maybe 5 times. I rode it more. I changed the forward foot controls to mid's and suspension was rough for city riding. I elected not to sink money into it since she wanted to sell it. The peanut tank guarantees a stop at a gas station any time you ride it.


She seems to be interested in a G310R. I rode a demo and it's extremely light and feels like I'd riding a tiny clown bike. Seems nice for a general commuter around town. I think the 310 is a nice beginners bike or "girls bike." Riding it at 50mph feels like riding the k75 at 90.


Back to loud pipes. I need to see the data behind it rather that hear the phrase. I suspect their is no data. The flat earth theory has more data than the "Loud pipes save lives" theory.
  • Indiana
  • '92 K75S, '17 R1200GS LC
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This space for rent

Offline Motorhobo

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Re: Rant
« Reply #21 on: October 02, 2017, 05:01:24 PM »
"K75 is fine...for a girl's bike"
"Nothing wrong with a K75 that another cylinder won't fix"
"Dude I think something fell off your K75 a few seconds ago..looks like...the missing cylinder!"


I say "Wow, that's original! Almost as original as 'So funny I forgot to laugh'".


Funny how 'loud pipes save lives' most often comes out of an oversized orifice in a head with no helmet on it.
Current:
1995 K75 ABS since 2000, 107k mi (101k mine)
1994 K75 ABS since 2015, 175k mi (none mine, waiting to be rejuvenated)

Dog Sidecar:
1994 K75 since 2013, 76,000 mi (11k mine) w/
California Sidecar Friendship II & Black Lab 'Miss B'

Past:
1974 Honda 550/4 (first bike)
1994 K75 (sold)
Sidecar Dog & Best Bud 'Bo' - RIP

Offline Martin

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Re: Rant
« Reply #22 on: October 02, 2017, 05:25:23 PM »
I Queensland it seems Hardleys are under different laws to the rest of the motorcycling world. They can produce as much noise as they want, whereas I would definitely be booked if I produced even half the decibels they produce. :dunno I've heard unsubstantiated stories that a deal was made. :dunno
Regards Martin.
  • North Lakes Queensland Australia
  • 1992 K75s, Lefaux, Vespa V twin

Offline The Mighty Gryphon

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Re: Rant
« Reply #23 on: October 02, 2017, 07:06:40 PM »
I've heard that the definition of a Hardley Ferguson is "a machine that converts gasoline into noise".

Yesterday, I had the misfortune to spend about 10 minutes in line at a toll booth directly behind a pirate and his bitch.  Every time the line moved forward one car length I was treated to a 130+db life-saving blast from his safety equipment. 
  • In my garage in Marilla, NY
  • '94 K75RT Mystic Red, '92K100RS White, '94 K75S Dakar Yellow
"Dohn f wit me, honkey, cuz I dindu nuffin'"

Current:
'94 K75RT "Ilsa, She Wolf of the SS"
'94 K75S "Cheetos"
'92 K100RS "Moby Brick"

Past:
'82 Honda FT500, '80 Honda XR185, '78 Honda XL125, '76 Honda XL125, '74 Honda XL125, '71 Ossa Pioneer, '68 Kawasaki 175

Offline Martin

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Re: Rant
« Reply #24 on: October 02, 2017, 07:58:33 PM »
Gryph QLD got rid of the last manned toll in 2009 all electronically done with number plate recognition, if you don't have a transponder. You will get a present in the mail if you don't ring and pay. Two local shopping centres also have number plate recognition first three hours parking is free, but after that you have to pay unless you are going to the flicks and then they give you another hour free. Motorcycles are exempt from paying at the shopping centre as the system shoots your front plate which is non existent on motorcycles. Road side mobile police radar traps also shoot the front of  your vehicle. The new unmanned camera trailers shoot the rear unfortunately.
Regards Martin.
  • North Lakes Queensland Australia
  • 1992 K75s, Lefaux, Vespa V twin