The Stellar Turbo K100

[stellarkyle]

The air filter on the intake tube might be hiding a blow off valve. Does it pop when you get out of the throttle?

I’ve never noticed anything like that. I’ve taken the pod off before and didn’t notice anything in there but I’ll take it off tomorrow and see what’s there.

Forgot to post this earlier. This is where the vacuum hose from the pink thing connects to the throttle body.

[Grim]

I’ve never noticed anything like that. I’ve taken the pod off before and didn’t notice anything in there but I’ll take it off tomorrow and see what’s there.

Forgot to post this earlier. This is where the vacuum hose from the pink thing connects to the throttle body.

Pink thing is fuel pressure regulator. It monitors intake vacuume. When You floor it intake vacuume drops and it gives more fuel. On my 1100 there is connections on the back that tie all four together to give the signal to the regulator. On he front it still has those ports to be used to balance the four throttles using a manometer.

[stellarkyle]

Pink thing is fuel pressure regulator. It monitors intake vacuume. When You floor it intake vacuume drops and it gives more fuel. On my 1100 there is connections on the back that tie all four together to give the signal to the regulator. On he front it still has those ports to be used to balance the four throttles using a manometer.

Do you know if this is standard on K100's or was it added because of the fifth injector? I couldn't find anything like it on the parts fiche.

All of my ports except the fourth one are hooked up instead of plugged... I'll check and see what all of them are connected to tomorrow.

[Grim]

Do you know if this is standard on K100's or was it added because of the fifth injector? I couldn't find anything like it on the parts fiche.

All of my ports except the fourth one are hooked up instead of plugged... I'll check and see what all of them are connected to tomorrow.

Looks about the same location as my 1100 in your picture just different in He vacuum plumbing.  The Fisch at Max’s shows it but not it’s mounting location. Part 2

[Arktasian]

The 5th injector model RB kit reportedly utilized a machined housing - that may be the "Cyan" item in your colored photo.
I believe the item you have colored "Pink" is a simple pressure sensor (not fuel pressure regulator), it is referenced to intake pressure and might be used to signal the water injection circuit (did you have that on yours?).
The fuel regulator which has the "T" fitting, and green hose heading to tank, does not appear to be manifold referenced (unless you have another small hose connected to it that isn't showing in your photos. If it isn't manifold (boost) referenced, then the ability to properly inject and maintain a good spray pattern while "in boost" is limited (mentioned this earlier). Being however as this is a kit you are seeking to just "run", and most likely don't wish to modify, you will have to stick with the design established by RB.
The pod filter on the right side looks suspiciously like an air bypass for "Anti Lag". That side of the charge air cooler is the cool side heading towards the inlet manifold and maf. You don't have a clear photo of the front lower area of the turbo, but I'm assuming there is a filter canister connected there to the compressor inlet, right? The pathway for air is pretty simple, it pressurizes through the compressor side of turbo, heads up to the left side of the "Split" cooler panel, exits on the right side heading back and should be turning 90 back towards inlet. There may be a "Flapper" type valve within the plumbing if that pod filter is connecting to this plumbing heading towards the inlet. It would open to allow air in during low throttle state "Roll Ons" so that things get going while the turbo is spooling.
If not, and its a blow off valve, it should be pretty obvious with a reference hose back to intake porting, and a cylindrical shape suggesting an internal valve and spring arrangement.

[stellarkyle]

The 5th injector model RB kit reportedly utilized a machined housing - that may be the "Cyan" item in your colored photo.
I believe the item you have colored "Pink" is a simple pressure sensor (not fuel pressure regulator), it is referenced to intake pressure and might be used to signal the water injection circuit (did you have that on yours?).
The fuel regulator which has the "T" fitting, and green hose heading to tank, does not appear to be manifold referenced (unless you have another small hose connected to it that isn't showing in your photos. If it isn't manifold (boost) referenced, then the ability to properly inject and maintain a good spray pattern while "in boost" is limited (mentioned this earlier). Being however as this is a kit you are seeking to just "run", and most likely don't wish to modify, you will have to stick with the design established by RB.
The pod filter on the right side looks suspiciously like an air bypass for "Anti Lag". That side of the charge air cooler is the cool side heading towards the inlet manifold and maf. You don't have a clear photo of the front lower area of the turbo, but I'm assuming there is a filter canister connected there to the compressor inlet, right? The pathway for air is pretty simple, it pressurizes through the compressor side of turbo, heads up to the left side of the "Split" cooler panel, exits on the right side heading back and should be turning 90 back towards inlet. There may be a "Flapper" type valve within the plumbing if that pod filter is connecting to this plumbing heading towards the inlet. It would open to allow air in during low throttle state "Roll Ons" so that things get going while the turbo is spooling.
If not, and its a blow off valve, it should be pretty obvious with a reference hose back to intake porting, and a cylindrical shape suggesting an internal valve and spring arrangement.

I think you’re right about both, Arktasian.

Here’s a better picture of the 5th injector.


And the “pink thing” is a Hobbs M4006-4 J5 fuel pressure switch. Their typical application is actually on aircraft.


There is a valve behind the pod filter.


I traced all the vacuum hoses coming off the throttle bodies. One goes to the fuel pressure switch, another goes to the turbo gauge on the dash, and the last goes to (what I think is) the wastegate.




Finally, I tested the the hall sensors. The connector under the tank disintegrated when I unplugged it. I tested the sensors anyway and one appears to be bad. I’ve ordered a new one from Euro Motoelectrics. Don’t know if this is the root of my rough idle issue, but it definitely wasn’t helping.

[Arktasian]

Kyle, when you removed the pod filter on the right side to expose the red cartridge inside, it looks a lot like it operates to open if negative pressure or vacuum is registered on the cooler plumbing side of things. The filter would have fit over that red cartridge? In that case, and without a reference line going from the workings to the inlet manifold it would be an "Anti Lag" type device I believe. If it did have a reference line hiding behind things then it could work as a blow off valve but wouldn't make much sense as most don't have or need a filter on them.

I have another aspect of your system to open for consideration - RB used two methods to scavenge oil from the drain point on the turbo cartridge. One was a traditional electric gear pump, rather sizeable and hard to miss. The other was a novel "Engine Oil Pump" check valve configuration that tee'd the suction side of pump inlet within lower crank case and pulled the oil out and up into the lube circuit. Have you inspected your turbo drain to see how the larger drain plumbing is configured? Chances are that it has a #8 low cracking pressure check valve immediately leaving that low point, followed by a #8 hose back to a fitting in the pan. If you look at that you will know there is no way oil will drain by gravity - most traditional turbos are placed well above the drain point connection on the crankcase of an engine which also must be above oil level by nature. I suspect you have the "Check Valve" arrangement.
The reason I'm asking is I have a fascination with the way this works, there is the exterior check valve you can see, low cracking pressure which serves to keep drain back oil from flooding the cartridge when engine is off. Without that you'd have a significant cloud of oil smoke every start up, and coking of the seals no doubt. Now, inside there is another check valve that is between the suction bell and the oil pump suction port, before the Tee'd connection point from the turbo suction drain line. Perhaps you have noted that on their web site and wondered. I believe they added the internal check valve to balance the suction that must be divided between turbo cartridge, and engine sump. A bit risky if imbalanced, one way might affect engine oiling, the other might reduce turbo drainability. On a turbo that hasn't been draining properly, you will oft times find oil films downstream in the compressor side of the tubing and charge air cooler. You may want to take those items apart to inspect and clean if there is an oil film (which might accumulate over time in a subtle way and not necessarily be a sign of trouble). If on the other hand there is fresh gleaming oil within those areas then you may need to inspect those check valves for trouble. If I'm not mistaken, the cracking pressure on the valve coming out of the turbo is around 1psi, and the valve inside the oil pan (actually mounted just on the top side of the flat removable portion) may be a slightly higher setting - to bias suction to not pull in lazy fashion from the easiest access in the sump. Oil is as with most fluids likely to take the pathway of least resistance.
Interested if you have any feedback.

[stellarkyle]

SHE'S ALIVE!





I replaced the hall sensor with an EnDuraLast one from Euro Motoelectrics. It won't really idle without giving it gas and has some knocking but at least I have throttle response now! Before, the engine would die if I gave it any gas. The bike is also smokes more than a Waffle House hostess. Am I right in thinking the timing is too advanced? I'll try rotating the hall sensor counter-clockwise to see if that improves anything.

Kyle, when you removed the pod filter on the right side to expose the red cartridge inside, it looks a lot like it operates to open if negative pressure or vacuum is registered on the cooler plumbing side of things. The filter would have fit over that red cartridge? In that case, and without a reference line going from the workings to the inlet manifold it would be an "Anti Lag" type device I believe. If it did have a reference line hiding behind things then it could work as a blow off valve but wouldn't make much sense as most don't have or need a filter on them.

I have another aspect of your system to open for consideration - RB used two methods to scavenge oil from the drain point on the turbo cartridge. One was a traditional electric gear pump, rather sizeable and hard to miss. The other was a novel "Engine Oil Pump" check valve configuration that tee'd the suction side of pump inlet within lower crank case and pulled the oil out and up into the lube circuit. Have you inspected your turbo drain to see how the larger drain plumbing is configured? Chances are that it has a #8 low cracking pressure check valve immediately leaving that low point, followed by a #8 hose back to a fitting in the pan. If you look at that you will know there is no way oil will drain by gravity - most traditional turbos are placed well above the drain point connection on the crankcase of an engine which also must be above oil level by nature. I suspect you have the "Check Valve" arrangement.
The reason I'm asking is I have a fascination with the way this works, there is the exterior check valve you can see, low cracking pressure which serves to keep drain back oil from flooding the cartridge when engine is off. Without that you'd have a significant cloud of oil smoke every start up, and coking of the seals no doubt. Now, inside there is another check valve that is between the suction bell and the oil pump suction port, before the Tee'd connection point from the turbo suction drain line. Perhaps you have noted that on their web site and wondered. I believe they added the internal check valve to balance the suction that must be divided between turbo cartridge, and engine sump. A bit risky if imbalanced, one way might affect engine oiling, the other might reduce turbo drainability. On a turbo that hasn't been draining properly, you will oft times find oil films downstream in the compressor side of the tubing and charge air cooler. You may want to take those items apart to inspect and clean if there is an oil film (which might accumulate over time in a subtle way and not necessarily be a sign of trouble). If on the other hand there is fresh gleaming oil within those areas then you may need to inspect those check valves for trouble. If I'm not mistaken, the cracking pressure on the valve coming out of the turbo is around 1psi, and the valve inside the oil pan (actually mounted just on the top side of the flat removable portion) may be a slightly higher setting - to bias suction to not pull in lazy fashion from the easiest access in the sump. Oil is as with most fluids likely to take the pathway of least resistance.
Interested if you have any feedback.

I appreciate your fascination with these turbo bikes! They're intriguing machines. I wasn't able to find a reference line so I think your assessment about it being for anti-lag is correct.

I'll have to look into the oil situation soon. I'm just trying to get the bike running at the moment but I'll definitely tear into the turbo soon and try to analyze how it all works!

[Arktasian]

Nice to hear it running, however some of your comments are potentially a concern.

"It has some knocking"? Was that there before, is this a detonation or pinging type sound or something mechanical. Have you taken a compression test?

"The bike also smokes more than a Waffle House hostess" (pretty funny) - I see you are on the center stand, is this something that has previously existed on runs you made or a recent development? Does it continue if you run for a while or subside. (these engines are susceptible to oil wash down into the cylinder when left on the side stand or similar which is more of a start up thing).  If its oil related you should be able to pick up on the smell pretty easily. Otherwise, and I'd be concerned it may be something to do with fuel system, it might be raw fuel dumping into her having an effect on smoke and the "knocking" you mentioned. You have previously mentioned a plethora of symptoms and unusual behaviour.
If your turbo is oiling the intake system it will gum up the charge air cooler and plumbing and smoke during operation too.
Was there oil around that lag valve when you had that apart (did you have the valve side of the unit taken apart?)
Just some thoughts on a Monday morning.

[DavidATL]

Kyle - looks like you, Grim and me are close. We should think about getting together later.

Sadly, I have pretty much only two pieces of advice for resurrecting old K's: inspect/change the pump vibration damper and change the under-tank o-ring. You've done them both! :-) I've done my spline lube twice so I may be able to offer some local eyeball advice on that one day. Regardless, hope your bike is back on the road soon!

Also, and I may be off base here, but have you changed the fuel pressure regulator since your unfortunate pump damper incident? It might have rubber bits in it preventing it from working correctly? Sorry if I missed a mention of this above.

David
(in Smyrna)

[stellarkyle]

So after finishing finals and a death in the family, I'm finally working on the bike again. After that last video of the bike working, I took it out for a test drive and it died on me again. I thought it was a bad battery at first (the old one wouldn't hold a charge) but a new battery didn't help. I was running into a problem where the starter wouldn't engage after a couple tries and the headlight would go out. The trick to clean the brushes (rolling the bike backwards and popping the clutch) helped. Since it sounded like a bad ground in the starter, I replaced the brushes. It now consistently turns over and the headlight no longer goes out.


I'm back to the exact same symptoms I was having before I replaced the hall sensor only the hall sensor is testing fine now. The fuel pressure in the system is still reading at 40 psi. The bike will run for 5-15 seconds and then die. Giving it any throttle kills it instantly. The spark plugs are wet.


After I first replaced the hall sensor, the bike was running really rough but I had throttle response for the first time. I adjusted the advance and adjusted the idle screw on the throttle body to run richer and the bike ran great. Then it died on the test ride. Now, I adjusted the idle richness screw to be leaner and it idles a little better/longer. Don't know if that means anything but thought I'd mention it.


I'm stumped.

Yeah, David! We should definitely put a group ride together.

[Martin]

Check the temperature sensor connector or the temperature sensor. A fault in either can cause over fueling.
Regards Martin.

K100 Temp Sensor Values.jpg (38.1 kB . 768x464 - viewed 1175 times)

[stellarkyle]

Check the temperature sensor connector or the temperature sensor. A fault I either can cause over fueling.
Regards Martin.

Turns out the connection between the MAF and the plenum had come loose. I had checked it with a flashlight but wasn't able to see the hose had slid off on the far side where I couldn't see. It's running and has throttle response again! Glad it was any easy fix! Hopefully the bike will stay running long enough for me to actually start working on the project!  :riding:

[BENSPEN]

Hey there stellar kyle,
Fellow K100 Turbo Owner Here (I Have a thread in the forum  about my cafe build as well, not as in depth as I dreamed it would be)(also a college student if you are as well) I've been off the forums for a few months which totally sucks because I could have helped with a lot of this, I have spent countless hours trying to decipher the puzzle that is the Rb Racing luftmiester relationship.


Firstly, What welds did luftmiester put to accommodate a wider wheel? I dont know if i have those,


The crankcase breather should not affect the running of the bike, i have run mine without one and with the plugged one, the plenum chamber should be blocked off to prevent crankcase pressurization as mentioned in the thread, The thing I find weird is that you dont have a secondary fuel pressure regulator, Seeing as how you are running only the original k bike FPR, You should definitely have a primary vacuum hose connected to the bottom of your FPR, the top one should be fuel from the tank and the bottom one should go to the right side of the fuel rail, Mine runs from tank to 2nd FPR with its own vacuum line then to the stock FPR with its own vacuum line then to the rail and it was a complete pain in the ass to figure out how to route, also it has a fuel pressure adjustment screw and honestly i dont think it does anything. I have another Bosch (I think??) Fpr on a custom plate with a wastegate controller attached to it bolted to the top of the block. As for the secondary Intake, It is only supposed to intake from that pod filter when the turbo is crating a vaccum or ambient pressure, there is a valve inside that closes when it pressurizes, I tested mine and it works surprisingly well, i have no idea why yours is red though, mine is silver. As for your fifth injector, The T line on your FPR should have fuel in it and if it goes to that fuel pressure switch I personally think it switches to allow fuel to be atomized by that wierd 5th injector, pretty cool setup. i am however  fairly certain it is either experimental luftmiester or put on by someone else. Im pretty sure whenever luftmiester put on a 5th injector it was a meth injector in the top of their custom aluminum plenum chamber made specifically for it, and i thought it was on later 1100s. also the throttle body vaccuum lines to the FPR make little difference in running, i thought my K had been dying due to a lack of vaccum, but i had some builder error problems.  :2thumbup:  Where is your wastegate conroller? It should be at the end of the two wastegate lines off your turbo. Also these dont have BOVs, I also am so positive i know where your non plugged in blue plug goes but its been a while for me. I dont know if you had mentioned it previously but the turbo is an IHI RHB52 VC19 if i remember correctly, its super simple, drilled bushings, non sealed, I can give you the turbo guys number should you need. also as i believe artasian said, the oil fed and drain on these is very temperamental and quite essential.


Also I found a cool pod filter for the turbo with a water shield i could probably dig up the link to

also contrary to my predictions, the turbo is awesome :riding:


ps sorry for how messy this paragraph was, i had a lot of thoughts.

[Arktasian]

Ben, its "Arktasian", derived from Arktos which is Greek for Polar Bear amongst other things. I choose the title as I was involved with the "Arktos" which is an ultra high mobility amphibious craft I participated in the engineering of. Mute point, right.
Seeing as how both you and Kyle are getting to know your tubo bricks, I'll offer again a word of advice for the oiling feed and scavenging. 
Through your posts, I see similarities in random, incorrect behaviour which deserves the highest attention on one of these RB designs, before a lot of run time is developed. Much cheaper and less carnage to suss things out in the garage while gaining a strong understanding of the entire turbo system and confirming the subtle bits are right.
Or not and see what happens, but be assured it can manifest in an alarmingly quick manner  on a boosted engine, as opposed to stock NA.
 

[stellarkyle]

Hey there stellar kyle,
Fellow K100 Turbo Owner Here (I Have a thread in the forum  about my cafe build as well, not as in depth as I dreamed it would be)(also a college student if you are as well) I've been off the forums for a few months which totally sucks because I could have helped with a lot of this, I have spent countless hours trying to decipher the puzzle that is the Rb Racing luftmiester relationship.

I've seen your thread! I've actually read through it a couple times trying to help troubleshoot my own turbo brick.

Firstly, What welds did luftmiester put to accommodate a wider wheel? I dont know if i have those,

Here's a picture of an article about the wheel I found online. I don't currently have a good picture of the welds but you can kind of see them in my post about my rear brake locking up.

The crankcase breather should not affect the running of the bike, i have run mine without one and with the plugged one, the plenum chamber should be blocked off to prevent crankcase pressurization as mentioned in the thread, The thing I find weird is that you dont have a secondary fuel pressure regulator, Seeing as how you are running only the original k bike FPR, You should definitely have a primary vacuum hose connected to the bottom of your FPR, the top one should be fuel from the tank and the bottom one should go to the right side of the fuel rail, Mine runs from tank to 2nd FPR with its own vacuum line then to the stock FPR with its own vacuum line then to the rail and it was a complete pain in the ass to figure out how to route, also it has a fuel pressure adjustment screw and honestly i dont think it does anything. I have another Bosch (I think??) Fpr on a custom plate with a wastegate controller attached to it bolted to the top of the block. As for the secondary Intake, It is only supposed to intake from that pod filter when the turbo is crating a vaccum or ambient pressure, there is a valve inside that closes when it pressurizes, I tested mine and it works surprisingly well, i have no idea why yours is red though, mine is silver. As for your fifth injector, The T line on your FPR should have fuel in it and if it goes to that fuel pressure switch I personally think it switches to allow fuel to be atomized by that wierd 5th injector, pretty cool setup. i am however  fairly certain it is either experimental luftmiester or put on by someone else. Im pretty sure whenever luftmiester put on a 5th injector it was a meth injector in the top of their custom aluminum plenum chamber made specifically for it, and i thought it was on later 1100s. also the throttle body vaccuum lines to the FPR make little difference in running, i thought my K had been dying due to a lack of vaccum, but i had some builder error problems.  :2thumbup:  Where is your wastegate conroller? It should be at the end of the two wastegate lines off your turbo. Also these dont have BOVs, I also am so positive i know where your non plugged in blue plug goes but its been a while for me. I dont know if you had mentioned it previously but the turbo is an IHI RHB52 VC19 if i remember correctly, its super simple, drilled bushings, non sealed, I can give you the turbo guys number should you need. also as i believe artasian said, the oil fed and drain on these is very temperamental and quite essential.

Yeah, as far as I can tell, I only have the one FPR and a fuel pressure switch (highlighted in pink). I've honestly not pin-pointed the location of my wastegate... The first time mine died, it was a bad Hall Sensor. The second and most recent time I think it was a combination of bad/weak battery, bad grounds in the starter, and the hose after the MAF sensor had partially come off.

I definitely need to tear into the turbo system. Pretty much everything turbo related on the front of the bike is oily... I likely have a small leak or two somewhere.

Also I found a cool pod filter for the turbo with a water shield i could probably dig up the link to

Nice! I'd love to see it.

Shoot me a text if you ever want pictures of an area of concern on another turbo bike, or you have any questions that I could answer (not many) (8028815211)
also contrary to my predictions, the turbo is awesome :riding:

Thanks! I'll definitely contact you. I've already grabbed your number so you may want to remove your number seeing as this is public and all...

I agree! When my bike is running, I love the turbo!

Seeing as how both you and Kyle are getting to know your tubo bricks, I'll offer again a word of advice for the oiling feed and scavenging.  Through your posts, I see similarities in random, incorrect behaviour which deserves the highest attention on one of these RB designs, before a lot of run time is developed. Much cheaper and less carnage to suss things out in the garage while gaining a strong understanding of the entire turbo system and confirming the subtle bits are right. Or not and see what happens, but be assured it can manifest in an alarmingly quick manner  on a boosted engine, as opposed to stock NA.

I agree. I need to tear into it to make sure everything it working properly. Definitely the better move long term. I've just been focused on getting the non-turbo components working. The last regular maintenance thing I need to do is check the splines. After that, I want to ride for a couple hundred miles to make sure everything non-turbo is working well before starting on the turbo.

[Arktasian]

So Kyle, your last comment is exactly what I am driving at. Ben made comments about "A seized turbo", but then proceeded to ride the bike and take stock of various obtuse symptoms like excessive oil consumption, etc. Was the turbo still on the bike?
The turbo when on your bike becomes part of the dna of operation. You can't just ignore it and ride, sort of like being just a little bit pregnant. It consumes main lube oil, and requires a tricky suction device to drain it, or risk blowing shaft seals and fill your intake and exhaust with oil as it is striving to function. That makes a mess much like Ben described. As well, even with a simple RB design for increasing fuel delivery, proper operation must be in effect or risk random fueling and operational issues.
In your case, confirming proper oil feed and scavenging is rather simple - running with the oil suction line removed from the turbo drain and having submerged in a smallish container partially filled with clean lube oil. When the test is conducted, run the bike at idle and other rpm's to witness that:
a) oil is exiting from the turbo drain fitting into the receptacle at a rate consistent with proper feed rate.
b) oil is being sucked from the receptacle at a rate higher than it is being filled - indicating the suction circuit is working correctly.

Edit added, the above test is only run while there is oil in the container, kill the engine just as soon as it has sucked the level down to the hose. You do not want to be running without oil in there as you would then be sucking basically straight air into the main lube circuit to the engine - with obvious results. If it isn't functioning as above, then you shouldn't be riding the bike at all.

[stellarkyle]

So Kyle, your last comment is exactly what I am driving at. Ben made comments about "A seized turbo", but then proceeded to ride the bike and take stock of various obtuse symptoms like excessive oil consumption, etc. Was the turbo still on the bike?
The turbo when on your bike becomes part of the dna of operation. You can't just ignore it and ride, sort of like being just a little bit pregnant. It consumes main lube oil, and requires a tricky suction device to drain it, or risk blowing shaft seals and fill your intake and exhaust with oil as it is striving to function. That makes a mess much like Ben described. As well, even with a simple RB design for increasing fuel delivery, proper operation must be in effect or risk random fueling and operational issues.
In your case, confirming proper oil feed and scavenging is rather simple - running with the oil suction line removed from the turbo drain and having submerged in a smallish container partially filled with clean lube oil. When the test is conducted, run the bike at idle and other rpm's to witness that:
a) oil is exiting from the turbo drain fitting into the receptacle at a rate consistent with proper feed rate.
b) oil is being sucked from the receptacle at a rate higher than it is being filled - indicating the suction circuit is working correctly.

Edit added, the above test is only run while there is oil in the container, kill the engine just as soon as it has sucked the level down to the hose. You do not want to be running without oil in there as you would then be sucking basically straight air into the main lube circuit to the engine - with obvious results. If it isn't functioning as above, then you shouldn't be riding the bike at all.

You're completely right, Arktasian. Before, I was thinking of the turbo as more of an add-on, not a vital part of the whole machine. I'll run this test as soon as I get a chance. Do you have any other tests you'd suggest?

I dont know if you had mentioned it previously but the turbo is an IHI RHB52 VC19 if i remember correctly, its super simple, drilled bushings, non sealed, I can give you the turbo guys number should you need.

Ben, I'd love the number of the turbo guy you used. How much did the rebuild run if you don't mind me asking?

[K_grendell]

Kyle, did you disassemble the fifth injector setup? I’d love to see how it was built, how many cc’s the injector is, and wonder at what psi the Hobbs switch kicks on? Do you know if you have a 8, or 12 psi kit?


I ask because I am building a k75 turbo with a sidecar right now. I’m using a new Borg Warner ball bearing/liquid cooled and smaller turbo for quick spool time but has a high cfm rate for up to 200 hp (which I’ll never see). My fueling is a bit more advanced than the Hobb switch, but I need to find a way to mount 2 injectors onto the manifold.


The valve/pod filter before your maf on the charge side of the turbo remains open under vaccuum until boost builds to retain proper throttle response.


Have you seen any ignition modifications for the kit? I.e. retards timing under boost?


Good luck with it, it’s a gorgeous bike!

[Skunky]

Turbo News.....

http://www.motobrick.com/index.php/topic,10818.msg93595.html#msg93595

[stellarkyle]

Kyle, did you disassemble the fifth injector setup? I’d love to see how it was built, how many cc’s the injector is, and wonder at what psi the Hobbs switch kicks on? Do you know if you have a 8, or 12 psi kit?

No, I haven't disassembled the 5th injector setup. I'm pretty sure it's the 12 psi kit.

Have you seen any ignition modifications for the kit? I.e. retards timing under boost?

I haven't seen any, no!

In your case, confirming proper oil feed and scavenging is rather simple - running with the oil suction line removed from the turbo drain and having submerged in a smallish container partially filled with clean lube oil. When the test is conducted, run the bike at idle and other rpm's to witness that:a) oil is exiting from the turbo drain fitting into the receptacle at a rate consistent with proper feed rate.b) oil is being sucked from the receptacle at a rate higher than it is being filled - indicating the suction circuit is working correctly.Edit added, the above test is only run while there is oil in the container, kill the engine just as soon as it has sucked the level down to the hose. You do not want to be running without oil in there as you would then be sucking basically straight air into the main lube circuit to the engine - with obvious results. If it isn't functioning as above, then you shouldn't be riding the bike at all.

I wanted to get some clarification before running this test. So I should disconnect the hose from the turbo drain, stick that hose in a container with some oil then also have to have another container to catch the oil coming from the turbo drain. I'd then compare the amounts of oil in the two containers and check to make sure that more is getting sucked up then is draining?

Does anyone know the proper oil feed rate for the turbo? I couldn't find any specs on RB's site.

[Arktasian]

No, I haven't disassembled the 5th injector setup. I'm pretty sure it's the 12 psi kit.




I haven't seen any, no!





I wanted to get some clarification before running this test. So I should disconnect the hose from the turbo drain, stick that hose in a container with some oil then also have to have another container to catch the oil coming from the turbo drain. I'd then compare the amounts of oil in the two containers and check to make sure that more is getting sucked up then is draining?

Does anyone know the proper oil feed rate for the turbo? I couldn't find any specs on RB's site.

The information is rather secretive online - but utilize a small Tupperware container that is about 1-2 litres, remove the drain line with its check valve from turbo drain port and submerge in half oil filled vessel. Get buddy to start with stop watch and see what she does at a) idle cold & hot, b) high revs hot. The fill behaviour is slow, like about 60-80ml/minute, while drainage should be much quicker, perhaps same volume in 20 seconds. I don't believe RB has posted these numbers anywhere but could be wrong.  Plain bearing turbos don't require a lot of oil, too much and it can overtake drain rate and blow past the seals to create "clouds of smoke" behind you. You need to confirm between cold/ hot and idle/ warm to ensure the system can handle variation that is inherent to that scavenge strategy.
Good luck.

In edit - VERY IMPORTANT - shut the test down before all the oil has been sucked from the container, or else you'll pull air into your main lube system - damage bottom end etc.

[stellarkyle]

The information is rather secretive online - but utilize a small Tupperware container that is about 1-2 litres, remove the drain line with its check valve from turbo drain port and submerge in half oil filled vessel. Get buddy to start with stop watch and see what she does at a) idle cold & hot, b) high revs hot. The fill behaviour is slow, like about 60-80ml/minute, while drainage should be much quicker, perhaps same volume in 20 seconds. I don't believe RB has posted these numbers anywhere but could be wrong.  Plain bearing turbos don't require a lot of oil, too much and it can overtake drain rate and blow past the seals to create "clouds of smoke" behind you. You need to confirm between cold/ hot and idle/ warm to ensure the system can handle variation that is inherent to that scavenge strategy.
Good luck.

In edit - VERY IMPORTANT - shut the test down before all the oil has been sucked from the container, or else you'll pull air into your main lube system - damage bottom end etc.

Thank you Arktasian! I'll give this a shot as soon as I can. I'm currently tackling the spline lube.


Speaking of which, I have the transmission off to lube the clutch spline and am trying to pinpoint the source of a slow leak I've had.

These are the parts I'm replacing:
Clutch Cable - 32 73 2 324 955
Clutch Boot - 23 13 1 338 731 (wasn't actively leaking but was deformed some)
x6 Screw - 21 21 1 454 417 (change recommended when removing clutch)
x6 Crush Washer - 21 21 1 242 377 (change recommended)
Hex Nut - 11 21 1 460 673 (change recommended)
Compression Ring - 11 21 1 460 696
O-Ring - 11 21 1 460 467


I've read that the O-Ring and Compression Ring are common places for leaks but I'm not sure this is the source. It looks as though the leak is coming from between the housing cover (#2) and the transmission. Is there not a gasket that goes here?


There's oil buildup where the two meet which makes it look like the source of the leak but might just be because there's a bit of a ridge there.

[Laitch]

It looks as though the leak is coming from between the housing cover (#2) and the transmission. Is there not a gasket that goes here?
There's oil buildup where the two meet which makes it look like the source of the leak but might just be because there's a bit of a ridge there.

You guys who work without manuals are a breed apart. Here's a page from a BMW workshop manual online—from this site, in fact.

[stellarkyle]

You guys who work without manuals are a breed apart. Here's a page from a BMW workshop manual online—from this site, in fact.

I appreciate it! I think I didn't find anything online about this because I was searching using the cover's part number instead of just "transmission cover"...